2024 Presidential Election Discussion Thread

[J. Dye]

On 1/26/2024 at 6:59 PM, Mech said:

Yeah I agree Gw.. People are just people and all have their own concerns for sure, but it still seems strange that there aren't any better candidates putting their hand up or being put forward. I don't understand how that can happen.

Democracy should in theory ensure that the best man wins.. Surely there must be better candidates, so why aren't they being pushed forwards ? How can there not be some better man or woman in a country of that size ?

Come on Johniii and Quad, explain that to me..  If you guys can see what's wrong with the candidates, why can't anyone else see it, and why aren't you or some other dissatisfied patriot putting their hand up ? And I have to ask, are either of you guys paid up members of either of the parties, do you attend the rallies, do you campaign or nominate someone better ?

I'd like to hear. I've asked earlier how it comes to this, and you both have plenty of criticism of the candidates, but you don't explain how it is they are the candidates.

 

 

It’s simple.  It’s because people are willing vote for someone that they don’t feel should be President and the Parties know that. 70% of Americans do not want Biden or Trump, but come Election Day almost all of that 70% will vote for one or the other.  So, we are the problem. I won’t vote for someone I do not think is qualified to be President.  I’m not going to play their game of “the lesser of two evils” so I won’t be voting for either one of them.  If there is an independent, I’ll vote for them.  You think we would get the same BS candidates next time if that 70% didn’t show up at the polls? It’s time that the parties learn to provide  candidates that the majority of people are comfortable voting for.

[quadmaniac]

On 4/4/2024 at 9:36 AM, J. Dye said:

If there is an independent, I’ll vote for them.  

Just curious if you find RFK a better choice on the independent ticket. We do need better candidates, I agree.

[J. Dye]

6 hours ago, quadmaniac said:

Just curious if you find RFK a better choice on the independent ticket. We do need better candidates, I agree.

I will definitely consider voting for him….although I haven’t spent much time reading up on him.  I won’t vote for a radical, even if they are saying things just to cater to a particular group to secure their vote.  It’s either him or my vote will be not to vote.  Kind of wish they would go ahead and throw Trump in jail and get it over with so we can move on because I would definitely vote for Haley. And yes, I realize that most of the stuff being thrown at Trump is political….but his behavior after the last election and the classified docs thing is a non starter for me. The classified docs thing is criminal.  And yes, Biden is a criminal in that regard too, that just means they should be sharing a cell.  Doesn’t mean they cancel each other out.

[quadmaniac]

17 minutes ago, J. Dye said:

The classified docs thing is criminal.  And yes, Biden is a criminal in that regard too, that just means they should be sharing a cell.  Doesn’t mean they cancel each other out.

Good point, and funny. RFK is known for his vaccine stance mostly. I wonder if he’ll Ross Perot the election. At the end of the day, the policies are what matter to me and I would like to see the border and my cost of living more like it was under Trump. I’m for work hard to get ahead and limit the slow creep towards socialism. It’s happening unfortunately, we’re living it.

[motonerd]

52 minutes ago, quadmaniac said:

Good point, and funny. RFK is known for his vaccine stance mostly. I wonder if he’ll Ross Perot the election. At the end of the day, the policies are what matter to me and I would like to see the border and my cost of living more like it was under Trump. I’m for work hard to get ahead and limit the slow creep towards socialism. It’s happening unfortunately, we’re living it.

 

1 hour ago, J. Dye said:

I will definitely consider voting for him….although I haven’t spent much time reading up on him.  I won’t vote for a radical, even if they are saying things just to cater to a particular group to secure their vote.  It’s either him or my vote will be not to vote.  Kind of wish they would go ahead and throw Trump in jail and get it over with so we can move on because I would definitely vote for Haley. And yes, I realize that most of the stuff being thrown at Trump is political….but his behavior after the last election and the classified docs thing is a non starter for me. The classified docs thing is criminal.  And yes, Biden is a criminal in that regard too, that just means they should be sharing a cell.  Doesn’t mean they cancel each other out.

 

[motonerd]

1 hour ago, J. Dye said:

I will definitely consider voting for him….although I haven’t spent much time reading up on him.  I won’t vote for a radical, even if they are saying things just to cater to a particular group to secure their vote.  It’s either him or my vote will be not to vote.  Kind of wish they would go ahead and throw Trump in jail and get it over with so we can move on because I would definitely vote for Haley. And yes, I realize that most of the stuff being thrown at Trump is political….but his behavior after the last election and the classified docs thing is a non starter for me. The classified docs thing is criminal.  And yes, Biden is a criminal in that regard too, that just means they should be sharing a cell.  Doesn’t mean they cancel each other out.

They all have classified documents. Vote for the one least likely to destroy America. 

[J. Dye]

2 hours ago, quadmaniac said:

Good point, and funny. RFK is known for his vaccine stance mostly. I wonder if he’ll Ross Perot the election. At the end of the day, the policies are what matter to me and I would like to see the border and my cost of living more like it was under Trump. I’m for work hard to get ahead and limit the slow creep towards socialism. It’s happening unfortunately, we’re living it.

Yeah, I liked some of Trump’s policies.  But I’m not down for Trump’s self professed “revenge tour”.  The Republican House is a disaster right now, can’t imagine what it would be like if Trump was actually in charge.  He’s already acting like the Dark Overlord Lol…. I’m a staunch Republican, but it really is a clown show right now.  I’m not so sure Trump would improve the situation.

[davefrombc]

In my  Canadian  view on your  election,  if you don't vote you are effectively voting for the worst possible candidate. I  am  not a "them or us"  voter.  I vote for the person  who I think will  best represent  my community, with a secondary regard for the party they represent.   In your  2 party system  that entails voting for  the "wrong party"  at times.

As  I see it , I don't agree with some of the things Biden  has done,  but the  main complaint against him is his age. He still  has control of all  his faculties,  His running mate  appears to me to be capable of doing the job if she has to take over  part way through the term.  I  could fill a data bank listing  tRump's  faults and connections to  Russia, his admiration of  dictators and  his immorality and flouting of   commercial  law and the  tax system. He certainly doesn't represent "Christian  values" as I  know them, I  find it appalling the support he  has among the  Evangelists. Kennedy  is   a nut case even  his family doesn't support and warns against  him.

There is a huge difference between  inadvertently possessing some  "classified"  documents  from  your administration and voluntarily  handing them  over  and  possessing and  sharing with individuals  who  are not unauthorized to see them, and then hiding them to  retain them.  For what  purpose  is a big question you should ask?  From  statements his staff has made,  he quite possibly  still have some stashed away that were  moved  while  the search of  Mar-A-Lago was under way.

Not voting   may  be a  choice, but as I said,  it  is in effect a vote for the worst possible candidate.  This  is the time to  vote for the best  candidate(s) offered despite whether they belong to the "wrong party"  or not.

[N00bie]

Please give me a truck driver or anyone that is not a complete idiot to vote for !!!!

[davefrombc]

30 minutes ago, N00bie said:

Please give me a truck driver or anyone that is not a complete idiot to vote for !!!!

You may feel  you have  poor  choices  but by not voting   you are  in effect casting a vote for the one who is the worst choice.

[J. Dye]

10 hours ago, davefrombc said:

In my  Canadian  view on your  election,  if you don't vote you are effectively voting for the worst possible candidate. I  am  not a "them or us"  voter.  I vote for the person  who I think will  best represent  my community, with a secondary regard for the party they represent.   In your  2 party system  that entails voting for  the "wrong party"  at times.

As  I see it , I don't agree with some of the things Biden  has done,  but the  main complaint against him is his age. He still  has control of all  his faculties,  His running mate  appears to me to be capable of doing the job if she has to take over  part way through the term.  I  could fill a data bank listing  tRump's  faults and connections to  Russia, his admiration of  dictators and  his immorality and flouting of   commercial  law and the  tax system. He certainly doesn't represent "Christian  values" as I  know them, I  find it appalling the support he  has among the  Evangelists. Kennedy  is   a nut case even  his family doesn't support and warns against  him.

There is a huge difference between  inadvertently possessing some  "classified"  documents  from  your administration and voluntarily  handing them  over  and  possessing and  sharing with individuals  who  are not unauthorized to see them, and then hiding them to  retain them.  For what  purpose  is a big question you should ask?  From  statements his staff has made,  he quite possibly  still have some stashed away that were  moved  while  the search of  Mar-A-Lago was under way.

Not voting   may  be a  choice, but as I said,  it  is in effect a vote for the worst possible candidate.  This  is the time to  vote for the best  candidate(s) offered despite whether they belong to the "wrong party"  or not.

As cited in the Hur report, Biden read classified material to his Ghost Writer. Which means, he had them, he knew he had them and he didn’t turn them in at the time, which means that his possession wasn’t “inadvertent”.  Not to mention reading classified documents to someone who didn’t hold a clearance….all those things are felonies.  Given all of that, it’s not hard to imagine that those documents weren’t just “stumbled upon” and that they were actively looking for them when they were “found” because Biden knew he had them.  I handled classified materials for 30 years so I am very knowledgeable about its handling and can assure you that no one “inadvertently” walks away with TS SCI documents. I have several issues with Biden beyond the classified materials issue, and therefore won’t vote for him. I have just as many issues or more with Trump. Personally, I’m done voting for someone I don’t think should hold the office.  It’s a great county, and still will be after the next term is over. It really amazes me that people think that one man can “destroy our Democracy. Our system has checks and balances and they work.

Edited April 16, 2024 by J. Dye

[N00bie]

5 hours ago, davefrombc said:

You may feel  you have  poor  choices  but by not voting   you are  in effect casting a vote for the one who is the worst choice.

Never said I wasn't going to vote, even voted in the primary, just said I wish their there was someone with some brains to choose from rather than a couple of idiots

[quadmaniac]

That was hard to watch. Someone needs to help him and he needs to make some tough choices. 

 

[Ulfthednar]

The real problem is you all think voting with paper is going to change things.

it hasnt in Forty Years.

No matter who gets elected . .

 

We all take it in the arse. . . . 

 

They all keep robbing us blind, taking more and more . . 

 

Creating more boundaries, walls and laws . . 

 

And your all arguing over who voted for the worst choice . . .

 

You know the answer.

 

Dont blame me for stating the obvious.

 

 

[quadmaniac]

It's a sad day in America. No matter what side you are on, an assasination attempt is over the line. Innocent people hurt and one killed. Unreal. 

 

[Gwbarm]

Thanks for sharing! I had been avoiding watching it. A very sad day, and a lucky man.

[Ulfthednar]

It is just another day of The Leftists demonstrating exactly what they accuse Conservatives of. A distinct lack of accord or consideration to the lives of others.

There has not been  ONE direct, pre meditated or instagatory attack against leftist, liberals, the rainbow mafia, ethnic groups or anything else. Reactive, yes. 

Liberalism these days is a delusional, violent mental illness.

[davefrombc]

I wouldn't be so quick to accuse the left of attempting to take tRump out.  It  very easily could have been a disgruntled Republican sick  of where  the wanna be  dictator and his cult have taken the  once great GOP.

 

you're right..  There hasn't been  ONE direct , pre-meditated attack by extremists on the right against those demonstrating  from the left..  There  have been  several.

Edited July 14, 2024 by davefrombc

[davefrombc]

Ulfthednar,  How are you going to spin  the report the shooter was in fact  a registered Republican?    Such violence is NEVER  justified  from  either the right  or the left. My sincere condolences to the families of the man  who died and the ones who were seriously injured.   Once again an AR15 style  weapon was used by a nut case in a senseless shooting,  and nothing will be done to remove  military style weapons from the hands of civilians .  Those guns have one purpose only , no matter how you try to  spin their  "|sporting" uses.  They are made to  kill  as many in as short a time as possible  and  the nut cases are drawn to them  like  magnets.

[quadmaniac]

1 hour ago, davefrombc said:

Ulfthednar,  How are you going to spin  the report the shooter was in fact  a registered Republican?    Such violence is NEVER  justified  from  either the right  or the left. My sincere condolences to the families of the man  who died and the ones who were seriously injured.   Once again an AR15 style  weapon was used by a nut case in a senseless shooting,  and nothing will be done to remove  military style weapons from the hands of civilians .  Those guns have one purpose only , no matter how you try to  spin their  "|sporting" uses.  They are made to  kill  as many in as short a time as possible  and  the nut cases are drawn to them  like  magnets.

The shooter registered republican in high school and voted but then its said he was donating to left groups. He also had a t-shirt on for some youtube channel for guns and ammo. Parents are behavioral counselors. He found something on the left that he must have identified with about Trump/other or is just a sick 20 year old who was influenced by stupidity.

There have been conservative shooters as well. I wouldn't jump to conspiracies just yet, either way. However, its just really odd that there was an open line of site from the building where he was from and they took him out so soon. I'll say that, because either it was a huge oversight, or someone helped pave the way.

 

[Ajmboy]

They better ramp up security on both sides. Regardless of who you align with, an assasination attempt on either to alter democracy is unacceptable. The rhetoric needs to tone down on both sides. It is eye-opening and very sad this can happen. I can't imagine what would happen if he was killed. 

I remember Reagan getting shot when I was a kid. Always thought it could happen but also thought as a country we were way past that with security, technology, etc. Just goes to show it can still happen.

 

[quadmaniac]

5 hours ago, davefrombc said:

the wanna be  dictator and his cult have taken the  once great GOP

I think this is the type of rhetoric that empowers some people with a bit of “screw-loose” to do something stupid. This rhetoric of Trump being hitler and a threat to democracy is silly and extreme. Comes from the top, right from Biden. 

Trump and republicans need to tamp it down as well. Trump will more than likely win and then be gone after four years. Democrats have time to reset and put someone better up. In the interim, everyone needs to stop the stupid over-the-top, world-will-end, rhetoric and get a new hobby. The “screw-loose” people have nothing better to do than listen to it and be influenced to do something like this.

[davefrombc]

I remember  when the GOP was the party fighting for civil rights and the  "Southern Democrats"  were the racist radicals pushing segregation. I remember the  Civil Rights Act of 1964, ( coincidentally the same year  Colt released the AR-15 to the public )  I remember  the shift of the right to  the GOP  and the left to the Dems largely starting after the  events after the Civil Rights Act  (1964)  and accelerating later with the election of Ronald Reagan.  I remember when the tax burden  in the US was much more  aimed at the rich and corporations rather than the  middle  and lower classes.  That  shift  got it's biggest bump  with Reaganomics.   I remember when the border was a minor inconvenience to  both Canadians and  Americans  visiting ,  playing and vacationing  back and forth.. No  passports or NEXUS  cards needed.   

I remember the US before the polarization  and radicalization  on  both sides of the middle  and  I  don't like to see what has  happened to the  US  over the years since  the 1980's . I will  be 81  in less than 2 months and look towards your November election with both  dread and hope for your national future. Hopefully the  moderates on both the  "right"  and "left"  will  prevail  but I see too  many  modern  parallels to the decline of the Roman Empire in  what's been happening.

[quadmaniac]

Great perspective @davefrombc , you've clearly seen a lot of history and have 30+ years over me. I think that as things get heated and elevated, they'll reset just as fast once the people have had enough. This event with an attempted assasination of a former president and candidate for the presidency is a tipping point. I think we will see tempers go down as everyone just got a strong reality check of what could have happened.

As I write this I think about what's changed, and the #1 thing that comes to mind is the internet, technology, media and overall connectivity. How fast information flows (good or bad) is what has helped build the highway for fast pollarization, sharing of opinions (good or bad) and just the overall of too much information available in an instant that sparks reactions. Too many opinion shows, youtubers, bloggers, etc. Sick individuals are easily influenced when they find an outlet sympathetic to their individual circumstance.

On another note, I would bring fourth legislation that allows individuals to run for any public office up to and until the official social security retirement age. They can be in office after that if securing a term, but only run before that birth date. In additon to that, there should be term limits across the board in the houses. 

[davefrombc]

1 hour ago, quadmaniac said:

 

As I write this I think about what's changed, and the #1 thing that comes to mind is the internet, technology, media and overall connectivity. How fast information flows (good or bad) is what has helped build the highway for fast pollarization, sharing of opinions (good or bad) and just the overall of too much information available in an instant that sparks reactions. Too many opinion shows, youtubers, bloggers, etc. Sick individuals are easily influenced when they find an outlet sympathetic to their individual circumstance.

On another note, I would bring fourth legislation that allows individuals to run for any public office up to and until the official social security retirement age. They can be in office after that if securing a term, but only run before that birth date. In additon to that, there should be term limits across the board in the houses. 

I  couldn't agree with you more  on how the internet has changed things both for the good and bad and for the very reasons   you  mentioned.-

I'm not so  much in agreement on  age and term limits. You  lose some very capable and intelligent people with them.   The changes in your system   I would like to  see  are the end to gerrymandering of voting districts and the elimination of the  Electoral  College.

 The   Electoral College served a purpose when  it  was instituted  but in today's reality it is counterproductive and definitely does not aerve the will  of the majority.. 

At a time when  much of the population spent their entire lives within 30  or so  miles of where they were born ,  and to  collect  and tabulate  the votes of the  entire nation in a Federal  election could take months,  the college  made sense,  but no  more in today's virtually instant  communication world wide.

Our political systems are different.  Both have their advantages   and disadvantages.  One  advantage I  feel  ours has is the elimination of gerrymandering..  Voting districts  are determined by population  numbers  and to  an extent  physical  boundaries by  and independent committee rather than  by  a political  party trying to gain  advantage  by fiddling  the boundaries  to  favour  one party  or limit another's voters f4om  getting to the polls to cast their votes.

Here is how  districts are  determined in  Canada for those that are curious

 https://electionsanddemocracy.ca/system/files/2019-10/Teacher fact sheet_EN.pdf

[JackThompson899]

Came here to tinker with my Yamaha and found this blast from the past. (IE: Political Discussion on a message board.. so 2003)

I remember feeling like folks on both sides of this, both liberal and conservative.. then seeing and learning that these are all literally propaganda talking points… handcrafted by likely the same team. No new ideas and no reality… you probably will think me nutty for saying that, but I’ve been paying attention for the last 40 years.. the game is rigged from the top down.. from the media to politics and the corporate conglomerates.

It is what it is. There’s no voting it away.

Thank you for this nostalgic view into the Matrix. Off to tinker with my Yamaha!

[johniii]

Davefrombc and Mech are  merely leftist trolls. Politics aside you guys seem like cool guys. 

[Gwbarm]

Tinkering is good, thats what i do to keep my mind off bad stuff.

[Mech]

Hey !! I object to that..  I'm a middle of the road troll  thank you..  A Lassiez-faire capitalist I've been told..  haha. That I wear.

Edited July 15, 2024 by Mech

[davefrombc]

Mech,  I  don't give fools that have nothing to  add to the forum   that helps or benefits the members the satisfaction of seeing his crap responded to.   His profile  pic says it all about him and the forum  members  know all to well who  the helpful  and thoughtful  members are  and who  are the trolls.